Hi David, Point 1 is very zen and I suspect no-one would argue Point 2 is more contentious- what facts are being referred to? ABA for instance classes Indonesia and the Christmas & Cocos Is as part of Asia, it depends which authority you choose to follow as to what the facts are! You can certainly argue for a transition avifauna, much like that of Sulawesi which has similarly been shunted around faunal zones, but you might like to be a tad less didactic about “facts” which can sometimes be something of a movable feast, depending on who you are following for your definitions.
Regards Phil Gregory Jebel Hafeet, UAE
At the risk of repeating myself, I would reiterate that:
1) All boundaries and borders, be they political, geographical, or biogeographical are artificial and temporary.
H
2) Christmas and Cocos (Keeling) Islands are no more and no less in the ‘Oriental’ or Indo-Malay faunal region or bioregion than they are in the Australo-Papuan region. Neither is part of Asia at this point in time or in their geological histories. Anyone asserting otherwise must not know the facts. Phil & Sue Gregory tour organizers/ bird guide/ ornithological writer Sicklebill Safaris / Cassowary House Http://www.sicklebillsafaris.com Http://www.cassowary-house.com.au Ph: +61740937318 Phil & Sue Gregory tour organizers/ bird guide/ ornithological writer Sicklebill Safaris / Cassowary House Http://www.sicklebillsafaris.com Http://www.cassowary-house.com.au Ph: +61740937318
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Comments
3 responses to “Definitions and facts”
It’s nice to know that Wikipedia is confused! Actually if you read their article they state “As a cultural construct, the concept of a continent may go beyond the continental shelf to include oceanic islands<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Island#Oceanic_islands>and continental fragments” which would allow for the inclusion in Asia. They also make it fairly clear that there is no universal agreement about continents, how many there are and what is included, so one can probably find as many authorities for including Christmas I in Asia as one can for excluding it! Seems to be almost as confusing a subject as taxonomy 🙂
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Hi Gentlemen, David, both Cocos and Christmas are oceanic Islands. That means that they arose from and sit over oceanic plates, and have never been connected to any continental land masses. Therefore they are not part of any continent. They may be close to Asia, but they are simply not a geological part of Asia (and Cocos is not so close to Asia anyway). I suspect that wikepedia would be confused about the definition of continents because of the difficulty in identifying a universal boundary between Asia and Europe, or some other reason that is irrelevant to the definition of oceanic islands. Whatever. Phil, my statement that all boundaries are transitional was an encapsulation of my earlier email indicating that: 1) the present political boundaries of France, Indonesia, Malaysia, Singapore and Australia (all countries previously mentioned by others in this string) are geologically recent artificial constructs; and 2) the geographical location of islands (and continents) is not static. Far from being zen, I suggest that continental France is only a small and artificial part of a geographic region, and that the nations of Indonesia and Malaysia straddle more than one geographical region but are not complete in their coverage of those regions. Phil, if the ABA (do you mean the American Birding Association?) classifies Cocos and Christmas as part of Asia, this would not constitute a fact but an opinion. There have been many opinions on where these islands belong, and I suspect that the ABA is just following an earlier opinion. Kloss (1929) regarded both as part of what he termed a Malaysian subregion, due to proximity, but considered Cocos as distinct a ‘province’ as Sumatra or Borneo. Chasen (1935) included both in his ‘Handlist of Malaysian Birds’. However, both islands were colonies of Singapore at the time and both men colonialists working for the Raffles Museum in Singapore. The current checklist of oriental birds (Inskip & Inskip 1993) includes Christmas but not Cocos or Wallacea. The Oriental Bird Club follows Inskip & Inskip but includes Wallacea, and not Cocos. Christidis & Boles (1994, 2008) included both islands on the Australian Checklist. These are all opinions or decisions about what to include and what to exclude. They are not facts. Here are some unpublished facts: The 14 resident landbirds on Christmas Island are 14% indomalayan, 14% Australian, 7% Wallacean, 21% introduced, and 43% equivocal. However, none are strictly from the nearby Greater Sundas (Sumatra, Borneo Java) subregion of the Indomalayan region. 65% of visitors and vagrant birds to Christmas are Palearctic migrants or pelagic seabirds, 24% are Indomalayan and 12% are Australian. I maintain that these islands are not unequivocally part of Asia on geological, biogeograpical, political, economical or cultural grounds. I am not claiming that they are unequivocally part of Australia on all grounds. They are oceanic islands in the Indian Ocean. If you disagree, please dispense with emotive descriptions of my style and provide some facts that prove me wrong.
Regardless of Wikipedia might have to say about the difienition of continents, — On Tue, 18/1/11, Dave Torr wrote:
Cc: burunglaut07@yahoo.com, birding-aus@vicnet.net.au Received: Tuesday, 18 January, 2011, 8:35 AM
Indeed – there is no universal agreement on what is a continent (see the Wikipedia article on continents and their boundaries) – just depends where and when you were taught. Most authorities seem to place that region in Asia – not just from the birding point of view!
Hi David, Point 1 is very zen and I suspect no-one would argue Point 2 is more contentious- what facts are being referred to? ABA for instance classes Indonesia and the Christmas & Cocos Is as part of Asia, it depends which authority you choose to follow as to what the facts are! You can certainly argue for a transition avifauna, much like that of Sulawesi which has similarly been shunted around faunal zones, but you might like to be a tad less didactic about “facts” which can sometimes be something of a movable feast, depending on who you are following for your definitions.
Regards Phil Gregory Jebel Hafeet, UAE
At the risk of repeating myself, I would reiterate that:
1) All boundaries and borders, be they political, geographical, or biogeographical are artificial and temporary.
H
2) Christmas and Cocos (Keeling) Islands are no more and no less in the ‘Oriental’ or Indo-Malay faunal region or bioregion than they are in the Australo-Papuan region. Neither is part of Asia at this point in time or in their geological histories. Anyone asserting otherwise must not know the facts. Phil & Sue Gregory tour organizers/ bird guide/ ornithological writer Sicklebill Safaris / Cassowary House http://www.sicklebillsafaris.com http://www.cassowary-house.com.au Ph: +61740937318 Phil & Sue Gregory tour organizers/ bird guide/ ornithological writer Sicklebill Safaris / Cassowary House http://www.sicklebillsafaris.com http://www.cassowary-house.com.au Ph: +61740937318
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Indeed – there is no universal agreement on what is a continent (see the Wikipedia article on continents and their boundaries) – just depends where and when you were taught. Most authorities seem to place that region in Asia
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