The IOC still treats Southern Boobook (Australian mainland) and Morepork (New Zeakand, Tasmania and formerly Norfolk) as 2 different species. It was recently discussed whether or not to split the Tasmanian form leucopsis from the NZ form novaeseelandiae, and split the Wet Tropics form lurida from the mainland form boobook. As a matter of process the IOC always places notices on the web site indicating POTENTIAL splits, lumps, name changes to encourage discussion and get feedback. In this case, the reason for the proposed split was to follow Howard & Moore. It turns out that there is not much evidence for support, so Frank Gill has decided to wait for further research that is underway by Frank Reindt et al. This could be some time away. I think it is unlikely that Reindt will recommend splitting lurida because the calls of lurida are indistinguishable from boobook. Not sure what is position is regarding leucopsis. Anyway, this highlights that changes proposed on the IOC notifications pages are not set in stone UNTIL they are incorporated in a quarterly update of the checklist. Cheers, David James Sydney ============================== =============================== To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send the message: unsubscribe (in the body of the message, with no Subject line) to: birding-aus-request@vicnet.net.au http://birding-aus.org ===============================
Hi Alan, sorry for the delay in replying, I’m on the road. I can’t speak for Frank Reindt of course. However, I made the comment that I think he is unlikely to recommend the splitting of lurida from boobook because of what he wrote in an email to Frank Gill (IOC Checklist manager) recently: “…our PRELIMINARY vocal analysis shows zero difference [of lurida] to other Southern Boobooks from throughout mainland Australia. I don’t know where these statements on vocal differences come from. I suspect these redder mountain birds are an eco-morph, just like Great Horned Owls in the Arizona desert are much more sand-colored. As such, one might even disagree on whether they deserve subspecific recognition”. I have never noticed a difference in vocals between lurida and boobook, but I may have overlooked subtle differences. It is years since I saw or heard lurida. Phil Gregory recently told me he didn’t think the was a difference in the calls. I’d like to know more about any vocal differences you (Alan) or anyone else has noticed. However, I would disagree that lurida is only an eco-morph. If it were, then there would be mixed pairs and mixed broods of red and normal morphs, and there is no evidence of that. I think really the only simple explanation for why there are no hybrids, no mixed pairs and broods, no introgression, is that boobook and lurida do not interbreed and are different species. However, this is a theoretical argument, whereas any split needs to be based on empirical evidence. ============================== ________________________________ From: Alan Gillanders < alan@alanswildlifetours.com.au > Sent: Monday, 23 September 2013 8:48 AM David, I find the statement, “I think it is unlikely that Reindt will recommend splitting lurida because the calls of lurida are indistinguishable from boobook,” amazing in the part about the calls. I don’t have the best of ears but they sure sound different to me. It has previously been suggested on this forum that as lurida will respond to the calls of boobook it is thus the same bird. For anyone chasing Rufous Owl in the Tolga Scrub, play Masked Owl to get a response from the Rufous. The birds are different not only in their appearance but their behaviour too, or so it seems to me. Do the normal boobook do a bobbing dance in the tops of trees where they act like a jack in the box popping out in different directions while making weird gurgling noises? Regards, Alan Alan’s Wildlife Tours 2 Mather Road Yungaburra 4884 Phone 07 4095 3784 Mobile 0408 953 786 http://www.alanswildlifetours.com.au/ —–Original Message—– Sent: Monday, September 23, 2013 8:29 AM The IOC still treats Southern Boobook (Australian mainland) and Morepork (New Zeakand, Tasmania and formerly Norfolk) as 2 different species. It was recently discussed whether or not to split the Tasmanian form leucopsis from the NZ form novaeseelandiae, and split the Wet Tropics form lurida from the mainland form boobook. As a matter of process the IOC always places notices on the web site indicating POTENTIAL splits, lumps, name changes to encourage discussion and get feedback. In this case, the reason for the proposed split was to follow Howard & Moore. It turns out that there is not much evidence for support, so Frank Gill has decided to wait for further research that is underway by Frank Reindt et al. This could be some time away. I think it is unlikely that Reindt will recommend splitting lurida because the calls of lurida are indistinguishable from boobook. Not sure what is position is regarding leucopsis. Anyway, this highlights that changes proposed on the IOC notifications pages are not set in stone UNTIL they are incorporated in a quarterly update of the checklist. Cheers, David James Sydney ============================== =============================== To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send the message: unsubscribe (in the body of the message, with no Subject line) http://birding-aus.org/ =============================== =============================== To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send the message: unsubscribe (in the body of the message, with no Subject line) http://birding-aus.org ===============================
David, I find the statement, “I think it is unlikely that Reindt will recommend splitting lurida because the calls of lurida are indistinguishable from boobook,” amazing in the part about the calls. I don’t have the best of ears but they sure sound different to me. It has previously been suggested on this forum that as lurida will respond to the calls of boobook it is thus the same bird. For anyone chasing Rufous Owl in the Tolga Scrub, play Masked Owl to get a response from the Rufous. The birds are different not only in their appearance but their behaviour too, or so it seems to me. Do the normal boobook do a bobbing dance in the tops of trees where they act like a jack in the box popping out in different directions while making weird gurgling noises? Regards, Alan Alan’s Wildlife Tours 2 Mather Road Yungaburra 4884 Phone 07 4095 3784 Mobile 0408 953 786 http://www.alanswildlifetours.com.au/ —–Original Message—– Sent: Monday, September 23, 2013 8:29 AM The IOC still treats Southern Boobook (Australian mainland) and Morepork (New Zeakand, Tasmania and formerly Norfolk) as 2 different species. It was recently discussed whether or not to split the Tasmanian form leucopsis from the NZ form novaeseelandiae, and split the Wet Tropics form lurida from the mainland form boobook. As a matter of process the IOC always places notices on the web site indicating POTENTIAL splits, lumps, name changes to encourage discussion and get feedback. In this case, the reason for the proposed split was to follow Howard & Moore. It turns out that there is not much evidence for support, so Frank Gill has decided to wait for further research that is underway by Frank Reindt et al. This could be some time away. I think it is unlikely that Reindt will recommend splitting lurida because the calls of lurida are indistinguishable from boobook. Not sure what is position is regarding leucopsis. Anyway, this highlights that changes proposed on the IOC notifications pages are not set in stone UNTIL they are incorporated in a quarterly update of the checklist. Cheers, David James Sydney ============================== =============================== To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send the message: unsubscribe (in the body of the message, with no Subject line) http://birding-aus.org =============================== =============================== To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send the message: unsubscribe (in the body of the message, with no Subject line) http://birding-aus.org ===============================