Month: November 2013

Does anyone know anything about the wildlife artist T Lindsey? Over the years we have picked up 6 prints of his or her watercolours, which are beautiful depictions of Australian birds. I have been unable to find anything through internet searches, which is surprising, given the proficiency of the artist. Any info gratefully received. Tim Jones Sent from my iPad =============================== To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send the message: unsubscribe (in the body of the message, with no Subject line) to: birding-aus-request@vicnet.net.au http://birding-aus.org ===============================

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Hello all,              We’ve just completed five days on Christmas Island as part of the annual Birding Tours Australia visits to the island.  Over five days we’ve seen all the endemics as well as five vagrants.  The island is still very dry with no sign of the wet season arriving any time soon.  Today we’re flying to Cocos for seven days. The five vagrants were: 1) Grey Wagtail 2) Asian Koel 3) Yellow Wagtail 4) Yellow Bittern 5) Savanna Nightjar I’ll provide a full trip report in mid Dec. The next tour to the islands is 4-15 March 2014. Cheers Richard Baxter Birding Tours Australia =============================== To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send the message: unsubscribe (in the body of the message, with no Subject line) to: birding-aus-request@vicnet.net.au http://birding-aus.org ===============================

I agree with just about everything you said. Most birders I know have, over the years, owned multiple different field guides and I find the concern about the perceived value of a second Australian app quite amusing. However, having worked for IBM for many years I think you meant ‘fired’ where you had ‘hired’ in “no one ever got hired for buying IBM”… Regards, Clive. Regards, Clive. —–Original Message—– From: David Adams <dpadams@gmail.com> To: Birding-Aus <birding-aus@vicnet.net.au> Sent: Sat, Nov 30, 2013 9:24 am Subject: Re: [Birding-Aus] Video Overview: Pizzey & Knight Digital Edition > > It amazes me that so many people consider the price of this app as > excessive. You get so much more than a book field guide with updates > provided. To update a book you need to wait until a new version is produced > and then pay at least the same as your original purchase price. For me, the > convenience of having multiple guides available on a lightweight device and > updated regularly at no further cost, is more than worth the initial outlay. > My answer ends up running long. Please skip or delete if you’re not interested. You’ve been warned 😉 Pricing is a black art and pricing psychology is not rational. One thing you can be sure of is that it’s a rarity that value assessments are based on measurable real-world benefit. As far as software purchases go, I think there are a couple of ways that people figure out if something is expensive or not: * How foolish will I look buying this if things go wrong? * How much do similar items cost? I think that the first point is the #1 factor in corporate IT software purchasing choices. (They used to say “no one ever got hired for buying IBM”…then “Microsoft.”) Will the software get the job done? Is this purchase good value for money? Sure, they matter….but the fear of embarrassment matters a whole lot more than is generally acknowledged. This is mostly another topic for another list, but the embarrassment risk also goes into personal choices. If I buy a .99 piece of software for my electronic thingy and it turns out to be junk, I won’t be missing any hot meals because of it. (Unless it was an app to show me where there are hot meals in the area and it tells me to navigate into an unpopulated area…) Even still….99 cents? Hmmmm. I think I might be happier with the .99 cents. In years gone by, software was expensive and had huge, huge margins. Even being a commercial programmer could be a fairly expensive undertaking…then Philippe Kahn released the Borland Pascal compiler for $100. It was about a 10th of the price of its competitors and was a better product. As time marched on, the price of high-quality shrink-wrapped software kept coming down. I’ve got a friend that likes shiny new things _and_ that is willing to take more of a risk on software purchases. He’s ready to say “Okay, it cost me $40 and it saved me 10 hours. I won’t keep using it but I got my money’s worth.” He’s unusual. Over the years I’ve also seen his “I’ll buy it and see how it goes” price go down from $39.95 then about 9.99 and it’s hovering now around 99 cents. Apple really didn’t entirely do programmers a favor by making zero the new 99 cents. You have to sell a whole lot of software at 99 cents (less 30%) to make a living. If you’re selling it for zero, you have to make it up on huge volume 😉 So, out there in the broader world software pricing has literally *nothing* to do with the value of the software. Obviously a sweeping generalization like that isn’t going to be true in every case, so take this as a general point that I’d argue applies to a whole lot of situations. Anyway, back to bird apps. Worth, value, and cost are pretty different properties. “Worth” is what they’re worth to you personally, cost is what they cost and value is a factor of the two. Cost is fixed, worth and value depend on us. By nearly any *rational* measure, birding apps can be considered cheap…even a $70 one. Well, if you use them, obviously. The amount of education, help and enjoyment you can get out of such an app is pretty vast. So, I won’t argue about the *worth* of these apps. Price is another matter… The question of what any of these apps is worth is, in many ways, tangental to what they should cost. The original developer may talk about their development costs, salaries, business expenses, costs of licensing sounds and images, the risk they faced from all of those costs before $1 could hit their bank account. Personally, I think that’s all reasonable. When it comes to price, I don’t care…it’s irrelevant. It just doesn’t matter in a market sense….your development costs have zero bearing on the ultimate value of the program to me or it’s ability to set a price in the market. I don’t mean that in a negative way or as a criticism of the software developers. (Honestly! I have nothing but thanks and praise, particularly for apps that go the extra mile like the Pizzey app.) “How big is that? is a similar question to “How expensive is that?” Size comparisons are based on just that, comparisons. If you don’t have something to compare to, you can’t judge size. Pricing is very, very much based by comparisons with similar things. If this cabbage costs $2/kilo, why does that one cost $10/kilo? For apps, people compare the price of similar apps. If Morcombe is $30 why is Pizzey $70? Again, Apple didn’t necessarily do developers a favor by reducing the standard costs of software to the incredible lows they’ve reached. (They give away their developer tools, make their developer program very cheap and make it all up on huge margins on their really excellent hardware.) Oh, a handful of popular open source projects have obviously had a lot to do with the price of software dropping…but, another subject for another list… Anyway, there isn’t any solid way to say if Pizzey is “big” and Morcombe is “normal” or if Pizzey is “normal” and Morcombe is “small”. I try to buy birding apps whenever I visit somewhere, even briefly. As a result, I’ve got apps for here, the US, Europe, southern Africa and some specialist guides. Sadly, much of the world doesn’t have guides or they’ve got guides of limited value. The standard price is around $30 although you’ll see amazing deals on US apps posted from time to time. (They’ve got a range of excellent apps and a whole lot of competition.) What does $30-40 buy you? The range of features is pretty broad: An electronic version of a paper guide with no sounds and a worthless index. +sounds +indexes and lists +birds comparison features +photographs +longer text articles +listing features +plus expert tips on hard-to-distinguish guides So, some guides are nothing but an expensive electronic book and others are full, fledged hyper-media apps with intelligently linked content….but the price is usually about the same. Given that, I tend to feel a bit burned if an app doesn’t have sounds and, by now, disappointed if it doesn’t have photographs. By that standard, the Pizzey app is expensive. Is it worth it? Meaning, is it a good value? That’s up to each person to decide. Overall, I like it better than Morcombe…but I expected to before I got it. And, to be fair, when you pay more for something you’ve invested just that much more into believing you made the right choice… P.S. I think I might have come off as sounding anti-Apple. That would be a mistake. Huge fan. And, for what it’s worth, they’ve done a fantastic job of getting developers money from apps. So much software has been pirated over the years…but not really with the App Store. They store experience is decent enough that I keep giving them money…and I’m cheap. I haven’t yet put any money into my Android apps….Apple owns me as I started out on iOS. P.P.S. Right, I forgot to mention: Birders pay more. I’ve got an app that’s an electronic version of a huge color guide to several thousand North American mushrooms. I think that it cost about $1…the book was $30-40. Is the app worth more than $1? I guess not…but if this were a field guide for birds or mammals, the app would cost a lot. Same with fish guides – they don’t cost much in app form but cost plenty on paper. With that said, there aren’t a lot of fish ID apps and the best one I’ve found to date is free. So, yeah, birding apps are priced partially on what the market will support…and that’s more than business apps, field guides for other subjects, entertainment, etc. In fact, they’re more expensive than just about any other app category I’ve seen. Not complaining…I’m grateful to have them…they’re the future of field guides and wonderful to have around…I only wish there were more. Here in Aus, we should feel grateful that we’re in a position to worry about which one to buy! P.P.S. For the iOS people out there, grab some discounted gift cards at Woolies or wherever and save a few dollars. =============================== To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send the message: unsubscribe (in the body of the message, with no Subject line) to: birding-aus-request@vicnet.net.au http://birding-aus.org =============================== =============================== To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send the message: unsubscribe (in the body of the message, with no Subject line) to: birding-aus-request@vicnet.net.au http://birding-aus.org ===============================

One hour ago I found a WTP key left in one of the gate locks – the entrance/exit gate from Point Wilson Rd to Paradise Rd. It has a large, red & green Christmas-type ribbon attached. Presumably it was accidentally left in the lock as a birder departed from the WTP. Can the owner, or anyone who knows whose it might be, contact me directly by email, mobile phone or text. Richard NOWOTNY Port Melbourne, Victoria M: 0438 224 456 =============================== To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send the message: unsubscribe (in the body of the message, with no Subject line) to: birding-aus-request@vicnet.net.au http://birding-aus.org ===============================

I also saw a dozen or more WTNT next to the western edge of Llke Weyba, Sunshine Coast on 29 November. Obviously coming in with the weather. Rob BurgoyneNow resident Sunshine Coast > Message: 3 > Date: Sat, 30 Nov 2013 08:26:04 +1000 > From: Marie Tarrant <sittella@gmail.com> > To: Birding Aus <birding-aus@vicnet.net.au> > Subject: [Birding-Aus] White-throated Needletails at Kobble Creek, SEQ > Message-ID: > <CABK7-PQxGZbf44E0vtrnfZdCBNXZcnqAP45oQhXTvku30KiwTQ@mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > Kobble Creek, Qld has been experiencing some heavy showers this morning > which have just eased causing me to step outside where I just counted > upwards of 75 White-throated Needletails flying over the property. > > > — > Marie Tarrant > Kobble Creek, Qld =============================== To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send the message: unsubscribe (in the body of the message, with no Subject line) to: birding-aus-request@vicnet.net.au http://birding-aus.org ===============================

The following is a digest of Sightings Reported on Birdpedia for the period Monday, December 2, 2013 to Sunday, December 8, 2013: Area: SA Location: White Road, Monarto. White-browed Woodswallow (Artamus superciliosus) (4) At least four White-browed Woodswallows amongst about a dozen Woodswallows seen over White Road, Monarto, about 4.5 km from junction with Ferries McDonald Rd. Other birds in flock appeared to be Masked Woodswallow, but due to tree cover and fast flight of birds it was difficult to confirm. Reported by: Bob and Maureen Snell on Monday, December 2, 2013 ——————————————— Date: Thursday, December 5, 2013 Location: East-West Railway Line between Cook and Ooldea Australian Bustard (Ardeotis australis) (5) Three Bustards alongside E-W Railway Line at Cook, 26 October 2013 Two Bustards alongside E-W Railway Line at Ooldea, 28 October 2013 Both observations by David Baxter Reported by: Chris Baxter on Thursday, December 5, 2013 ——————————————— Date: Thursday, December 5, 2013 Location: Kangaroo Island Elegant Parrot (Neophema elegans) (3) Three flushed up from edge of 7 year post-fire E. remota (KI Mallee-Ash) scrub at intersection of Playford H’way and West End H’way, West Gosse Lands, Flinders Chase NP, Kangaroo Island, 4 December 2013. First birds observed this season-seemingly a post-breeding visitor to KI from mainland. Rock Parrot (Neophema petrophila) (4) one near Point Marsden, KI, 23 November 2013-first one seen for this summer season-seemingly a post-breeding visitor to KI from mainland. three at Remarkable Rocks, Flinders Chase NP, KI, 4 December 2013 Australian Brush-turkey (Alectura lathami) (1) one ran across Cape du Couedic Road, Flinders Chase NP, c 5 km N of Admirals Arch, 4 December 2013. Peregrine Falcon (Falco peregrinus) (1) one adult male in flight over Cape Willougby, KI, 5 December 2013. Rugged coastal cliffs and pasture. Reported by: Chris Baxter on Thursday, December 5, 2013 ——————————————— Date: Saturday, December 7, 2013 Location: Gregory street Port Elliot 5212 Crested Shrike-tit (Falcunculus frontatus) (1) Bird was calling from a South Australian gum Tree close to my house. The bird has been hanging around the area for 3 days. Reported by: Winston Syson on Sunday, December 8, 2013 ——————————————— Date: Saturday, December 7, 2013 Location: Greenfields Wetlands, Magazine Road, Dry Creek Ruff (Philomachus pugnax) (1) Still present. Sat in the open for a while on an island to the west of the winding path with two stilts. Long-toed Stint (Calidris subminuta) (1) To the east of the winding path. Also present in this area several Wood Sandpiper, Sharpies and Red-necked Stints. Reported by: Kevin Stracey on Saturday, December 7, 2013 ——————————————— Date: Sunday, December 8, 2013 Location: Emes Court, Athelstone Eastern Koel (Eudynamys orientalis) (1) The bird has been heard calling for 2-3 weeks, moving between a park at the street end and other large trees nearby. Reported by: Graeme Cellier on Sunday, December 8, 2013 ——————————————— Need more information about a sighting? Login and contact the poster directly. Receive sightings via email or SMS immediately they are posted. Not a member of Birdpedia? Membership is free and gives you access to information for over 230 countries. To sign up go to the Birdpedia Web Site (http://www.birdpedia.com/). To find out more about Birdpedia and what it can do for you, see ‘What is Birdpedia?’ ———————————————

David, Mea culpa. Carl > On 30 Nov 2013, at 8:23, David Stowe <davidstowe@optusnet.com.au> wrote: > > Carl I don’t think you have read my response or Peter’s comments correctly. There was never any discussion or comparison of the difficulty of writing it in the first place – only a comparison of how much work is needed to change it from printed form to digital form. > > Cheers > David > >> On 29/11/2013, at 10:52 PM, Carl Clifford <carlsclifford@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> David, >> >> I think most authors of fiction would take you to task over your downplaying the difficulty of writing a novel. James Joyce was happy to be able to produce one sentence in a day. Many authors would tell you that writing a novel is like giving birth to an elephant, sideways. Writing a field guide, in electronic or paper format is basically the assembly of existing data and illustrations by a crew. Not exactly the same as writing literature. >> >> Carl Clifford >> >>> On 29 Nov 2013, at 21:23, David Stowe <davidstowe@optusnet.com.au> wrote: >>> >>> Personally i can’t believe the Morcombe app is so cheap especially with the calls. Who else spent hundreds of dollars collecting the BOCA CD set?! >>> >>> Also there is so much more development work/cost that goes into an app compared to the printed book. You can’t honestly compare a novel with this app? There is zero added functionality to a novel -essentially its simply a “scan” of the printed version. >>> >>> Go and buy an ebook from CSIRO publishing for another example – ones i have looked at were the same cost as the printed book without any added functionality and no printing cost. >>> >>> Cheers, >>> David Stowe >>> >>> >>>> On 29/11/2013, at 4:09 PM, Peter Shute <pshute@nuw.org.au> wrote: >>>> >>>> True, but the Morcombe app is, I think, half the price, has more in it than a paper field guide, and so far the updates have been free. >>>> >>>> I don’t know how much it costs to distribute an app via Apple, etc, but there’s no shop front paying rent, no transport costs, no printing costs. The electronic version of a typical novel is usually a lot less than the printed version. >>>> >>>> Perhaps the Morcombe app is under priced, I don’t know. >>>> >>>> Peter Shute >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>>> On 29 Nov 2013, at 2:58 pm, “Arthur & Denise” <art.den@bigpond.com > wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Thanks for the video guide Marc. >>>>> >>>>> It amazes me that so many people consider the price of this app as excessive. You get so much more than a book field guide with updates provided. To update a book you need to wait until a new version is produced and then pay at least the same as your original purchase price. For me, the convenience of having multiple guides available on a lightweight device and updated regularly at no further cost, is more than worth the initial outlay. >>>>> >>>>> Arthur Carew >>>>> =============================== >>>>> >>>>> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, >>>>> send the message: >>>>> unsubscribe >>>>> (in the body of the message, with no Subject line) >>>>> to: birding-aus-request@vicnet.net.au >>>>> >>>>> http://birding-aus.org >>>>> =============================== >>>> =============================== >>>> >>>> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, >>>> send the message: >>>> unsubscribe >>>> (in the body of the message, with no Subject line) >>>> to: birding-aus-request@vicnet.net.au >>>> >>>> http://birding-aus.org >>>> =============================== >>> >>> =============================== >>> >>> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, >>> send the message: >>> unsubscribe >>> (in the body of the message, with no Subject line) >>> to: birding-aus-request@vicnet.net.au >>> >>> http://birding-aus.org >>> =============================== > =============================== To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send the message: unsubscribe (in the body of the message, with no Subject line) to: birding-aus-request@vicnet.net.au http://birding-aus.org ===============================

> > It amazes me that so many people consider the price of this app as > excessive. You get so much more than a book field guide with updates > provided. To update a book you need to wait until a new version is produced > and then pay at least the same as your original purchase price. For me, the > convenience of having multiple guides available on a lightweight device and > updated regularly at no further cost, is more than worth the initial outlay. > My answer ends up running long. Please skip or delete if you’re not interested. You’ve been warned 😉 Pricing is a black art and pricing psychology is not rational. One thing you can be sure of is that it’s a rarity that value assessments are based on measurable real-world benefit. As far as software purchases go, I think there are a couple of ways that people figure out if something is expensive or not: * How foolish will I look buying this if things go wrong? * How much do similar items cost? I think that the first point is the #1 factor in corporate IT software purchasing choices. (They used to say “no one ever got hired for buying IBM”…then “Microsoft.”) Will the software get the job done? Is this purchase good value for money? Sure, they matter….but the fear of embarrassment matters a whole lot more than is generally acknowledged. This is mostly another topic for another list, but the embarrassment risk also goes into personal choices. If I buy a .99 piece of software for my electronic thingy and it turns out to be junk, I won’t be missing any hot meals because of it. (Unless it was an app to show me where there are hot meals in the area and it tells me to navigate into an unpopulated area…) Even still….99 cents? Hmmmm. I think I might be happier with the .99 cents. In years gone by, software was expensive and had huge, huge margins. Even being a commercial programmer could be a fairly expensive undertaking…then Philippe Kahn released the Borland Pascal compiler for $100. It was about a 10th of the price of its competitors and was a better product. As time marched on, the price of high-quality shrink-wrapped software kept coming down. I’ve got a friend that likes shiny new things _and_ that is willing to take more of a risk on software purchases. He’s ready to say “Okay, it cost me $40 and it saved me 10 hours. I won’t keep using it but I got my money’s worth.” He’s unusual. Over the years I’ve also seen his “I’ll buy it and see how it goes” price go down from $39.95 then about 9.99 and it’s hovering now around 99 cents. Apple really didn’t entirely do programmers a favor by making zero the new 99 cents. You have to sell a whole lot of software at 99 cents (less 30%) to make a living. If you’re selling it for zero, you have to make it up on huge volume 😉 So, out there in the broader world software pricing has literally *nothing* to do with the value of the software. Obviously a sweeping generalization like that isn’t going to be true in every case, so take this as a general point that I’d argue applies to a whole lot of situations. Anyway, back to bird apps. Worth, value, and cost are pretty different properties. “Worth” is what they’re worth to you personally, cost is what they cost and value is a factor of the two. Cost is fixed, worth and value depend on us. By nearly any *rational* measure, birding apps can be considered cheap…even a $70 one. Well, if you use them, obviously. The amount of education, help and enjoyment you can get out of such an app is pretty vast. So, I won’t argue about the *worth* of these apps. Price is another matter… The question of what any of these apps is worth is, in many ways, tangental to what they should cost. The original developer may talk about their development costs, salaries, business expenses, costs of licensing sounds and images, the risk they faced from all of those costs before $1 could hit their bank account. Personally, I think that’s all reasonable. When it comes to price, I don’t care…it’s irrelevant. It just doesn’t matter in a market sense….your development costs have zero bearing on the ultimate value of the program to me or it’s ability to set a price in the market. I don’t mean that in a negative way or as a criticism of the software developers. (Honestly! I have nothing but thanks and praise, particularly for apps that go the extra mile like the Pizzey app.) “How big is that? is a similar question to “How expensive is that?” Size comparisons are based on just that, comparisons. If you don’t have something to compare to, you can’t judge size. Pricing is very, very much based by comparisons with similar things. If this cabbage costs $2/kilo, why does that one cost $10/kilo? For apps, people compare the price of similar apps. If Morcombe is $30 why is Pizzey $70? Again, Apple didn’t necessarily do developers a favor by reducing the standard costs of software to the incredible lows they’ve reached. (They give away their developer tools, make their developer program very cheap and make it all up on huge margins on their really excellent hardware.) Oh, a handful of popular open source projects have obviously had a lot to do with the price of software dropping…but, another subject for another list… Anyway, there isn’t any solid way to say if Pizzey is “big” and Morcombe is “normal” or if Pizzey is “normal” and Morcombe is “small”. I try to buy birding apps whenever I visit somewhere, even briefly. As a result, I’ve got apps for here, the US, Europe, southern Africa and some specialist guides. Sadly, much of the world doesn’t have guides or they’ve got guides of limited value. The standard price is around $30 although you’ll see amazing deals on US apps posted from time to time. (They’ve got a range of excellent apps and a whole lot of competition.) What does $30-40 buy you? The range of features is pretty broad: An electronic version of a paper guide with no sounds and a worthless index. +sounds +indexes and lists +birds comparison features +photographs +longer text articles +listing features +plus expert tips on hard-to-distinguish guides So, some guides are nothing but an expensive electronic book and others are full, fledged hyper-media apps with intelligently linked content….but the price is usually about the same. Given that, I tend to feel a bit burned if an app doesn’t have sounds and, by now, disappointed if it doesn’t have photographs. By that standard, the Pizzey app is expensive. Is it worth it? Meaning, is it a good value? That’s up to each person to decide. Overall, I like it better than Morcombe…but I expected to before I got it. And, to be fair, when you pay more for something you’ve invested just that much more into believing you made the right choice… P.S. I think I might have come off as sounding anti-Apple. That would be a mistake. Huge fan. And, for what it’s worth, they’ve done a fantastic job of getting developers money from apps. So much software has been pirated over the years…but not really with the App Store. They store experience is decent enough that I keep giving them money…and I’m cheap. I haven’t yet put any money into my Android apps….Apple owns me as I started out on iOS. P.P.S. Right, I forgot to mention: Birders pay more. I’ve got an app that’s an electronic version of a huge color guide to several thousand North American mushrooms. I think that it cost about $1…the book was $30-40. Is the app worth more than $1? I guess not…but if this were a field guide for birds or mammals, the app would cost a lot. Same with fish guides – they don’t cost much in app form but cost plenty on paper. With that said, there aren’t a lot of fish ID apps and the best one I’ve found to date is free. So, yeah, birding apps are priced partially on what the market will support…and that’s more than business apps, field guides for other subjects, entertainment, etc. In fact, they’re more expensive than just about any other app category I’ve seen. Not complaining…I’m grateful to have them…they’re the future of field guides and wonderful to have around…I only wish there were more. Here in Aus, we should feel grateful that we’re in a position to worry about which one to buy! P.P.S. For the iOS people out there, grab some discounted gift cards at Woolies or wherever and save a few dollars. =============================== To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send the message: unsubscribe (in the body of the message, with no Subject line) to: birding-aus-request@vicnet.net.au http://birding-aus.org ===============================

As a former software developer just getting into writing my first (Android) app then perhaps I might comment. Apps have changed the face of the software industry. In the days of PCs (and Macs as well I guess, although I have never had one) software was in general either free, pirated or quite expensive. With the advent of a new model for software and for its distribution we have become used to apps being either free (in which case they usually make money via adverts) or incredibly cheap. In either case the developers rely on volume of downloads – although I suspect that many are disappointed as there are just so many apps around. Unfortunately for us, birding apps do take a lot of work and (I assume) have to pay a fair bit to license the images and calls they use (I cannot recall how much I paid for my set of BOCA Bird Call CDs but it was I think over $200, and a friend recently bought a Fred van Gessel set of calls that was I recall about $60). We also have the issue that there is a fairly small market for such things I guess. So I think we should be amazed at the fact that we can get a set of calls (which used to cost over $200 and now perhaps cost $60) with all the other things thrown in for a fairly reasonable sum of money. Yes it is dearer than the book (and again we are used to eBooks being cheaper than paper ones) but there is a hell of a lot more in a birding app than in the book. Anyway – no-one is forcing it on us. People will make their own minds up what they spend their money on. Software is a funny game to price – the cost of initially producing it is usually large but the costs of an individual copy/distribution are (excluding retailers’ markups) almost zero. So whereas for many goods you can set a price based on the cost of producing an item plus a profit that is not the case with software – you have to make some form of guess as to how many you will sell in order to recoup your costs. Get it too wrong and the market will let you know! On 30 November 2013 08:23, David Stowe <davidstowe@optusnet.com.au> wrote: > Carl I don’t think you have read my response or Peter’s comments > correctly. There was never any discussion or comparison of the difficulty > of writing it in the first place – only a comparison of how much work is > needed to change it from printed form to digital form. > > Cheers > David > > On 29/11/2013, at 10:52 PM, Carl Clifford <carlsclifford@gmail.com> wrote: > > > David, > > > > I think most authors of fiction would take you to task over your > downplaying the difficulty of writing a novel. James Joyce was happy to be > able to produce one sentence in a day. Many authors would tell you that > writing a novel is like giving birth to an elephant, sideways. Writing a > field guide, in electronic or paper format is basically the assembly of > existing data and illustrations by a crew. Not exactly the same as writing > literature. > > > > Carl Clifford > > > >> On 29 Nov 2013, at 21:23, David Stowe <davidstowe@optusnet.com.au> > wrote: > >> > >> Personally i can’t believe the Morcombe app is so cheap especially with > the calls. Who else spent hundreds of dollars collecting the BOCA CD set?! > >> > >> Also there is so much more development work/cost that goes into an app > compared to the printed book. You can’t honestly compare a novel with this > app? There is zero added functionality to a novel -essentially its simply a > “scan” of the printed version. > >> > >> Go and buy an ebook from CSIRO publishing for another example – ones i > have looked at were the same cost as the printed book without any added > functionality and no printing cost. > >> > >> Cheers, > >> David Stowe > >> > >> > >>> On 29/11/2013, at 4:09 PM, Peter Shute <pshute@nuw.org.au> wrote: > >>> > >>> True, but the Morcombe app is, I think, half the price, has more in it > than a paper field guide, and so far the updates have been free. > >>> > >>> I don’t know how much it costs to distribute an app via Apple, etc, > but there’s no shop front paying rent, no transport costs, no printing > costs. The electronic version of a typical novel is usually a lot less than > the printed version. > >>> > >>> Perhaps the Morcombe app is under priced, I don’t know. > >>> > >>> Peter Shute > >>> > >>> Sent from my iPad > >>> > >>>> On 29 Nov 2013, at 2:58 pm, “Arthur & Denise” <art.den@bigpond.com > > wrote: > >>>> > >>>> Thanks for the video guide Marc. > >>>> > >>>> It amazes me that so many people consider the price of this app as > excessive. You get so much more than a book field guide with updates > provided. To update a book you need to wait until a new version is produced > and then pay at least the same as your original purchase price. For me, the > convenience of having multiple guides available on a lightweight device and > updated regularly at no further cost, is more than worth the initial outlay. > >>>> > >>>> Arthur Carew > >>>> =============================== > >>>> > >>>> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, > >>>> send the message: > >>>> unsubscribe > >>>> (in the body of the message, with no Subject line) > >>>> to: birding-aus-request@vicnet.net.au > >>>> > >>>> http://birding-aus.org > >>>> =============================== > >>> =============================== > >>> > >>> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, > >>> send the message: > >>> unsubscribe > >>> (in the body of the message, with no Subject line) > >>> to: birding-aus-request@vicnet.net.au > >>> > >>> http://birding-aus.org > >>> =============================== > >> > >> =============================== > >> > >> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, > >> send the message: > >> unsubscribe > >> (in the body of the message, with no Subject line) > >> to: birding-aus-request@vicnet.net.au > >> > >> http://birding-aus.org > >> =============================== > > =============================== > > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, > send the message: > unsubscribe > (in the body of the message, with no Subject line) > to: birding-aus-request@vicnet.net.au > > http://birding-aus.org > =============================== > =============================== To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send the message: unsubscribe (in the body of the message, with no Subject line) to: birding-aus-request@vicnet.net.au http://birding-aus.org ===============================